Hoagies & Stogies

What is Hoagies & Stogies?

Hoagies & Stogies is a men’s fellowship for reformed, theological debate; it was created by one of my elders before he was an elder. When he was ordained, he got too busy, and he gave the reins of the ministry to me. The men gather for a simple meal of hoagies, with home-brewed beer, or wine, or soft drinks. After a while, we all refill our glasses, and those who are so inclined light up their best stogies and kick back and enjoy a theological debate. But if you are not a smoker (like me), or not a drinker (or not both!), you are still welcome. (You can consider it your mission to ensure that Christian liberty is exercised with due charity!)

What/when/where is the next Hoagies & Stogies?

• What: Translation philosophy: Functional (NIV) vs. Formal (ESV)
• When: Sat Jan 23, 5pm–
• Where: The Patton Compound (click for map) (don’t confuse Barbic Ln with Barbic Ct)
• Who:
  • Advocating the Dynamic translation philosophy (as exemplified by the NIV), we have Dr. Mark Strauss, Bethel Seminary, author of  ”Why the English Standard Version (ESV) Should Not Become the Standard English Version: How to Make a Good Translation Much Better” (as well as many other works both popular and academical, including Truth & Error in the DaVinci Code: The Facts about Jesus and Christian Origins).
  • Advocating the Formal translation philosophy (as exemplified by the ESV), we have Ed Hale (MDiv, WSCAL), who is an Associate Pastor for Family Ministries and Discipleship at Cornerstone Church in Escondido (EFCA) and a former Southern California Field Representative for Logos Bible Software. A good, quick perspective of Formal over Dynamic translations can be found in this article by John Piper.

What were the previous Hoagies & Stogies?

Most recent and on back, with links to post-debate discussion/audio when available…

• Sabbath — Sabbatarian: Jeff Kazules, Loose: Reuben Settergren
• Confessionalism — Pro: Brian Tallman, Con: Davie Copp
• Communion — Real Spiritual Presence: Mike Brown, Real Physical Presence: John Kent
• Baptiterians — Strict: Mike Brown, Tolerant: Brian Tallman
• Federal Vision (Covenant of Works) — Merit: Jonathan Goundry, Grace: Jacob Moya
• Dispensationalism — Pro: John Pulliam, Con: Brian Tallman
• Exclusive Psalmody — Pro: Mark England, Con: Jonathan Goundry
• Ordination of Women — Pro: Glen Scorgie, Con; Brian Tallman
• Just War (U.S. in Iraq) — Pro: Guy Kemp, Con; Brian Tallman
• Postmil/Amil — Postmil: Tom McManus, Amil: Gene Cook
• Theonomy — Pro: Jeff Kazules, Con: Gene Cook
• Christian Counseling — Integrationist: George “Skip” Scipione, Christian: Jim Newheiser
• Creation Days — Framework: Dean Abbott, Day-Age: Reuben Settergren, 6×24: Tom Moller
• Is Roman Catholicism Christian? — Pro: Dean Abbott, Con: Mike Ewing
• Does God “desire” salvation of the non-elect? — Pro: Brian Tallman, Con: Mike Ewing
• Tongues — Pro: Brian Tallman, Con: Mike Ewing

Note that occasionally, a speaker was acting as devil’s advocate, so not everybody listed can actually be credited (blamed) for a doctrine just because they are listed here.

What are the rules of Hoagies & Stogies?

• Hoagies & Stogies is a men’s fellowship; please don’t bring any female-type people.
• The cost to all but H&S officials is a low $7 to cover the cost of food and beer.
• Bring your own Stogies, pipes, or other smoking materials.
• All smoking (and debating) will be outside, so also bring your own lawn chairs (and jackets).
• Affirmative RSVPs are mandatory (negative RSVPs optional), to ensure sufficient food. I will accept RSVPs all the way up to the day of, so never feel that it is too late to get in on the action!

What is the format of Hoagies & Stogies?

• Men gather at 5pm on the specified Saturday night, and start eating. When everybody is settled with a sandwich, a chair, a stogie, and a beer (or any subset thereof), we proceed with:
• Moderator’s opening statement (5-10min): Define relevant terminology, explain the issue, establish scope, precisely state the agreed-upon question.
• Opening statements (20min ea): each debater argues positively for their own position
• Rebuttals (10min ea): each debater argues negatively against their opponent’s position
• Closing (5min ea): each debater gives a 5 minute summary
• Break: submit questions, refill glasses
• Q&A: Debaters address submitted questions as a panel discussion.

What if I missed Hoagies & Stogies?

Then you should subscribe to the Hoagies & Stogies Podcast! (Thanks to The Onomist) Or just poke around this link to see if you can find what you’re looking for.

What if I have something to say about Hoagies & Stogies?

If you want to RSVP, or have questions or suggestions for upcoming topics or debaters, just drop a comment right here!